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Post by Hans Schokkenbroek on Dec 23, 2018 8:39:45 GMT
Ok.... The hot potato.
Up to now I had not felt the need to post any FE material on this site. But that changed this morning when I felt the need to watch this video where a Flat Earther tries to debunk his own theory. Very refreshing. The new official flag of the Earth is......... the Seed of Life from which the Flower of Life, the blueprint of the Universe, is derived!! How in your face do you want to make it?
Some believe Flat Earth is a distraction to those who are trying to become more aware. People can get totally lost in the FE theory and end up trying to convince everyone else of this obvious (to them) fact. Yet most if not all of those who visit this forum have probably looked into it.
So why am I creating a thread? Well, those that know me.... simple; I feel I should do that. My HS tells me to do it. Also, most members are not here to convince others of anything, they are here to learn, share and discern.
And, I got an insight as well. When I started looking into Flat Earth what really resonated with me is the essential difference between a heliocentric model and a flat earth model. The relevance of man.. When the heliocentric came to the forefront suddenly man was no longer the centre of the universe.. No longer important. I could see the cleverness of such a plan if I were trying to hide the Truth and keep man ignorant about his origin. It did not help to find out that all major characters in the plot (Galileo, Copernicus, Newton, Darwin etc) turned out to be Freemansons...
And I can see the benefit of creating so much confusion around FE that it becomes virtually impossible to understand what is true and what is not. And sure enough, some researchers totally avoid mentioning FE, like Angeliki. Maybe because it might distract the reader from the points he or she was trying to make.
For your discernment......
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Post by ray on Dec 24, 2018 1:33:12 GMT
I have yet to read in the news of any ship falling off the edge of our supposed flat earth.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 24, 2018 2:14:09 GMT
For a human body it's hard to perceive living on a ball shaped planet. Do understand though if the Earth were flat we would have lots of pictures of folks looking over the edge.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 26, 2018 11:52:01 GMT
You can see from space or even from an airplane at high altitude that the earth is round. Earths shadow on the moon is round. But also things like seeing further from higher up and being able to watch a sunset twice in a day (from a low point then a high point on a hill). Yeah the flat earth thing is defo misinformation and beliefs.
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Post by Hans Schokkenbroek on Dec 26, 2018 14:01:04 GMT
You can see from space or even from an airplane at high altitude that the earth is round. Earths shadow on the moon is round. But also things like seeing further from higher up and being able to watch a sunset twice in a day (from a low point then a high point on a hill). Yeah the flat earth thing is defo misinformation and beliefs. Haha, it is interesting how different people's perceptions are. I have really really tried with total neutrality to observe roundness but I cannot observe any roundness with my own senses. Not in a plane nor at the beach or from a mountain. Just shows how different we all are... It does not matter what I believe to be my truth as it is only relevant to myself and no-one else...
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2018 6:19:25 GMT
For a human body it's hard to perceive living on a ball shaped planet. Do understand though if the Earth were flat we would have lots of pictures of folks looking over the edge. We only go where our transport infrastructures take us, so if there is an edge we probably wouldn't see it hehe There are also 'electric fences' (in the movies anyway... I think I saw them in Valerian and Superwoman... if I remember correctly). And apparently there is a 'real world' and a superimposed 'matrix' or 'projection'
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Post by Hans Schokkenbroek on Dec 29, 2018 9:49:58 GMT
You can see from space or even from an airplane at high altitude that the earth is round. Earths shadow on the moon is round. But also things like seeing further from higher up and being able to watch a sunset twice in a day (from a low point then a high point on a hill). Yeah the flat earth thing is defo misinformation and beliefs. The last thing I wish to create on this forum is indeed a distraction for members and guests from the many other topics that can be found on the forum. So this is not about being right and I trust it will not evolve in a long string of posts where one party presents their view as THE truth trying to convince the others of their errors. None of us are able to see the entire picture whilst we are here on Earth (again in my humble opinion). We can only see things from our perspective and therefor we all see part of the truth but never the whole truth. And as often mentioned, we only see the things the way WE are, not the way things actually are. In addition we are constantly fooled by our limited senses and more importantly by our belief systems that more often than not are fixed. AND our perceptions are often based on the programming that we have received during our life. We all 'know' the Earth is round because we are taught it is round, not because we were one day looking around, observing the Earth, and then came to the realisation that it is round because we saw the roundness, we felt it spinning like mad around its axes, spinning around the Sun and at the same time felt the whole solar system travelling through the Universe at incredible speed.. No... We were told by the schoolbooks and by NASA that the world is round. And from that programming, we started looking around with the pre-conceived notion that the world is round... I would argue that very few have been observing the Earth from a neutral standpoint. If you have a preconceived notion in your mind you will find it much easier to find evidence of that notion in your de facto non-neutral observations. Like when you buy a red car you suddenly see red cars everywhere. Indeed when you ask the average Joe if he has ever actually seen with his own eyes that the Earth is round you will almost always hear a yes. I can only speak for myself but I have made serious, really serious efforts, in observing roundness and I have failed so far. And it is NOT because I have a pre-conceived notion that the Earth is flat, and it also does not mean that I now believe the Earth to be flat. All I know is that I do not observe roundness . It does not really matter to me personally if the Earth is flat or round or oblique or donut shaped.. I do think the implications of a heliocentric model are extremely significant. It makes the importance of man insignificant and that is very convenient if you want to control the masses and make them think they are powerless beings... So I am very suspicious of the heliocentric model especially if I realise how I came to know the Earth is a ball shape and where that information comes from... Mika and Ray are making the statement that we should have many pictures of people falling of the edge if the Earth is flat. I am assuming this is meant to be evidence that the Earth is not flat. Well, the lack of pictures of the edge does NOT constitute proof that there is no edge.... And even if there would be pictures of the edge then that in itself does not constitute proof that there IS an edge. Pictures can be faked you see.... History as we well know can be faked. EVERYTHING external of us can be faked... When a topic like FE is discussed it is interesting to see that it quickly becomes a discussion about external observations. And like CO2, FE is one those topics that has almost become a religion (and it is of course very much linked to religion). So rather than proposing a view that may be different to Mika's or Ray's arguments I would just like to say this; Whatever arguments others make on whatever topic there is only ONE place in my humble opinion where you can get your own truth. Inside of yourself.... So there is no need to convince anyone of anything. Living your life based on your inner feeling is a life that is self-actuated. At least that is what I have experienced so far... I am as ever grateful for all contributions on this forum..
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2018 11:17:45 GMT
The last thing I wish to create on this forum is indeed a distraction for members and guests from the many other topics that can be found on the forum. So this is not about being right and I trust it will not evolve in a long string of posts where one party presents their view as THE truth trying to convince the others of their errors. None of us are able to see the entire picture whilst we are here on Earth (again in my humble opinion). We can only see things from our perspective and therefor we all see part of the truth but never the whole truth. And as often mentioned, we only see the things the way WE are, not the way things actually are. In addition we are constantly fooled by our limited senses and more importantly by our belief systems that more often than not are fixed. AND our perceptions are often based on the programming that we have received during our life. It does not really matter to me personally if the Earth is flat or round or oblique or donut shaped.. And even if there would be pictures of the edge then that in itself does not constitute proof that there IS an edge. Pictures can be faked you see.... History as we well know can be faked. EVERYTHING external of us can be faked... When a topic like FE is discussed it is interesting to see that it quickly becomes a discussion about external observations. And like CO2, FE is one those topics that has almost become a religion (and it is of course very much linked to religion). Whatever arguments others make on whatever topic there is only ONE place in my humble opinion where you can get your own truth. Inside of yourself.... So there is no need to convince anyone of anything. Living your life based on your inner feeling is a life that is self-actuated. At least that is what I have experienced so far... Thank you SO much Hans for your views!!! I took out those comments that completely resonate with me! They express EXACTLY what I have been feeling as well, but I was still looking for words to express them. I find it interesting that people say they know the truth, because this or that has been proven by scientists. Just as you say Hans, pictures and information can be faked. The only place indeed where you can get your own truth is inside of yourself. This forum is NOT about convincing others of what one believes, it is about sharing and helping one another!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2018 12:06:43 GMT
Of course no one can genuinely prove what shape the earth is, or prove anything. And I don't think it really matters what it is at the end of the day. However I would like to say, the view that the earth is round makes the most sense over any other theory, based on if you add up all the scientific evidence (including measurements done by scientific tools), people's accounts of the shape of earth and photographs. Sure if you ignore all these things you could argue for the view of flat earth. (I know some people think the photos are fake) Maybe on some alternate version of the world where everything is flat this view would make sense, but in the phyical viewable/visable version of the earth at least of classic physics, the round version of the earth is the one that makes the most sense. I mean at one level you can say people don't exist only atoms etc. Or if anything exists at all.
Sure in the past a lot more people believed in flat earth, though that was before advances in science which helped 'prove' the view that the earth is round, but even before then much people supported round earth, particularly astronomers who would watch how the stars would go round the earth. I think from all this it is most pragmatic to assume the earth is round and not something else, unless there is a broader view out there someone can show me. I'm still in the bounds to question science for example the theory of evolution has many gaps. If earth was flat, I think things like gravity wouldn't be the same. Now you may not trust scientists but here is one view. "First of all, a pancaked planet might not have any gravity. It’s unclear how gravity would work, or be created, in such a world, says James Davis, a geophysicist at Columbia University’s Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory. That’s a pretty big deal, since gravity explains a wide range of Earthly and cosmic observations. The same measurable force that causes an apple to fall from a tree also causes the moon to orbit the Earth and all the planets to orbit the sun. People who believe in a flat Earth assume that gravity would pull straight down, but there’s no evidence to suggest it would work that way. What we know about gravity suggests it would pull toward the center of the disk. That means it would only pull straight down at one point on the center of the disk. As you got increasingly far from the center, gravity would tug more and more horizontally. This would have some strange impacts, like sucking all the water toward the center of the world, and making trees and plants grow diagonally, since they develop in the opposite direction of gravity’s pull.' blogs.ei.columbia.edu/2018/01/24/flat-earth-what-would-happen/I heard the theory that gravity is just a field made by the government to confuse people, but that is quite a far out accusation to make. But I guess not for some who think everything is a product of the government. Gravity is still a theory of course like everything else but it would take something else to change the view of that. The problem is a lot of flat earth theorists do not have any convincing arguments and most of it is just refutting common sense. Much of them believe things based on misconceptions or paranoia and no matter what you argue they will argue back religiously, so their view is based on belief. We should trust in ourselves but not ignore the observable physical characteristics. If you join up all the dots and the understanding of the earth it really makes a lot of sense, that the earth is round. The bigger picture and the details all come together, it is not just one theory on it's own. To prove that the earth is flat, you would have to disprove a lot of science, including geography and physics. If earth was a smaller the roundness would be a lot more visible, just like standing on the moon is more visibly round. And it doesn't really make sense why other planets are round yet we are not. Are we really the center of the universe, with heaven above and hell below? Let's consider that the 'cack influence' creates illusory realities in peoples minds and makes it hard to think clearly. Also if a misconception becomes common it's easier for people to stick together, I do not know if this also works at the hive mind level as mandela effect theorists claim (not proven). I understand why people don't believe it because scientists have mislead them before. But, i'm not sure why it matters so much because the shape of the earth doesn't really express any inner truth, just the laws of physics. It isn't really something to get caught up in. I do believe that with a bit of observation you can see these things for yourself, and that it isn't a product of conditioning of the mind. I think it's important to trust yourself, but you should also question yourself because not everything is what you think it is. I think people should however still come to that conclusion themselves, but from what i've seen the flat earth view doesn't bring anything new to the table that can't be shown better with round earth. B.O.B. wanted to send up a camera into space to prove the earth was flat (he didn't do it). However his experiment was only using the same technology that everyone does, so he would hardly see anything different to what was already seen. That said I respect B.O.B. as a great musician and he does try to be original.
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Post by girlscout on Dec 29, 2018 13:47:28 GMT
Of course no one can genuinely prove what shape the earth is, or prove anything. And I don't think it really matters what it is at the end of the day. ... I mean at one level you can say people don't exist only atoms etc. Or if anything exists at all.... I understand why people don't believe it because scientists have mislead them before. But, i'm not sure why it matters so much because the shape of the earth doesn't really express any inner truth, just the laws of physics. It isn't really something to get caught up in. ... Thanks Griffey! I am reminded of a phrase: “You can be right, or you can be happy”. Lol Also: www.jainworld.com/literature/story25.htmELEPHANT AND THE BLIND MEN Once upon a time, there lived six blind men in a village. One day the villagers told them, "Hey, there is an elephant in the village today." They had no idea what an elephant is. They decided, "Even though we would not be able to see it, let us go and feel it anyway." All of them went where the elephant was. Everyone of them touched the elephant. "Hey, the elephant is a pillar," said the first man who touched his leg. "Oh, no! it is like a rope," said the second man who touched the tail. "Oh, no! it is like a thick branch of a tree," said the third man who touched the trunk of the elephant. "It is like a big hand fan" said the fourth man who touched the ear of the elephant. "It is like a huge wall," said the fifth man who touched the belly of the elephant. "It is like a solid pipe," Said the sixth man who touched the tusk of the elephant. They began to argue about the elephant and everyone of them insisted that he was right. It looked like they were getting agitated. A wise man was passing by and he saw this. He stopped and asked them, "What is the matter?" They said, "We cannot agree to what the elephant is like." Each one of them told what he thought the elephant was like. The wise man calmly explained to them, "All of you are right. The reason every one of you is telling it differently because each one of you touched the different part of the elephant. So, actually the elephant has all those features what you all said." "Oh!" everyone said. There was no more fight. They felt happy that they were all right. The moral of the story is that there may be some truth to what someone says. Sometimes we can see that truth and sometimes not because they may have different perspective which we may not agree too. So, rather than arguing like the blind men, we should say, "Maybe you have your reasons." This way we don’t get in arguments. In Jainism, it is explained that truth can be stated in seven different ways. So, you can see how broad our religion is. It teaches us to be tolerant towards others for their viewpoints. This allows us to live in harmony with the people of different thinking. This is known as the Syadvada, Anekantvad, or the theory of Manifold Predictions.
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Post by Hans Schokkenbroek on Jan 2, 2019 11:32:53 GMT
The very fact that even people like Micheal Tellinger do not want to discuss FE is a sign to me that it IS very important to discuss it. It is central to the difference between materialism and spirituality. So I will post some video's of people that I value and in my view come with a very balanced and open minded approach to this subject...
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Post by Hans Schokkenbroek on Jan 2, 2019 11:37:53 GMT
These 2 videos are amongst my favourites because Dave approaches it with humour and neutrality. As a little by-product, it also offers an explanation why people do not fall of the edge . If you do not want to spend the time looking at these than I would advise part 2 from around min 40 where Dave goes into the why? Warning for those of you who totally believe in Space. Do not watch these videos as it may shock your belief systems . As always, for your discernment. The answers are ultimately within yourself IMHO...
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2019 15:47:29 GMT
Personally I am not going to get much into the round earth flat earth thing. To be honest both possibilities seem wrong to my senses. But is shaped like something right?
One weird thing I observed last week. It was about 10:30 in the morning and the sun had risen and was reasonably high in the sky in the southeast. The waning 1/2 moon was still reasonably high in the now daytime west. I said 1/2 moon so to my senses the earth could not have been shadowing the dark 1/2 of the moon because the 2 bodies (sun and moon) had non obstructed views of each other. Weird.
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Post by IW on Jan 24, 2019 5:53:11 GMT
I like this one from RFB/
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Post by IW on Jan 24, 2019 6:08:00 GMT
This one is great, took me over 20 minutes of searching on youtubbe, they did not want me to find it.
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Post by ML on Jan 24, 2019 6:17:47 GMT
"Like or subscribe.....or dont!"
I like that "D
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Post by ML on Feb 21, 2019 1:24:08 GMT
Flat Earth debate is distracting me right now. LMAO
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Post by Hans Schokkenbroek on Jun 3, 2019 14:24:04 GMT
Yes......
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Post by ML on Jun 4, 2019 1:31:03 GMT
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Post by OneWhoIsAwake on Feb 2, 2021 18:51:51 GMT
i've been looking at this for some years now and he may be right.
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Post by Hans Schokkenbroek on Feb 3, 2021 16:12:35 GMT
It must be co-incidence that last week my attention was drawn to a video suggesting that the world is concave, the exact opposite of what we are taught. Early on in my awareness path I came across some good advice. Assume the opposite of what you have been taught and you may be very close to the truth. In my experience that often is true. So who knows. Maybe the Earth is concave. What comes to mind with this topic and many other for that matter is the Allegory of Plato's Cave. I am not sure if there is a thread on this. In his book the Replubic Plato describes the human race using the allegory of a cave. You can look it up on the internet but he very accurately describes what I have personally experienced and now see as my working model. The 3D world is fake, it is an illusion and the majority of humanity is totally oblivious to that fact.
Howdie Mickoski has made 2 interesting videos on his YT channel about the Allegory of Plato's Cave. The topic of the shape of this Earth triggered me to write this little warning which may resonate with some.
Most people that manage to break the illusion, that manage to unchain themselves in the cave actually never make it out of the cave. What happens to most is that they start exploring the cave and then run into other like minded people who have also freed themselves. Some are totally in the shape of the Earth, some are into UFO and aliens, some are exploring the fake HIS-story, some are absorbed by Planet X or Wormwood etc etc etc.. One can spend his or hers entire life exploring one of these topics. So most people actually are still captured in the Matrix and they totally forget why they are here... namely to LIVE. They are totally distracted and never make it out of the cave to find the wonders of the world.
I think it has value to explore topics as long as you are totally guided AND it has meaning in this 3D world. Initially I spent 18 hours per day exploring the cave and that was needed to increase my awareness of the system we live in. Nowadays, I spend maybe an hour per day. Like the other day when the concave Earth theory came by. But I only watch something if my Guides tell me to.
Myka and I have gone very different paths over the past years. Yet I think we are converging towards the same point. Each personal path is different but I have a feeling they all lead to the same place as long as we all listen to our guidance. These days I usually call that guidance Spirit because I am more drawn to the Native American / Aboriginal teachings. Others may call it God, or Source of the Divine. It does not matter. The principle is to let yourself be guided for actions you do in this world. I agree with Myka that this life is all we have right now. And I think we are here for a very good reason.
From what I know now exploring the lies of this world only matters if it is firmly rooted in whatever you do in this 3D realm. Like standing with one foot inside the cave and one foot outside. So there is a balance to be struck between the metaphysical and the physical. The Spirits cannot operate in the 3D world and we cannot operate in the Spiritual world.
The only important thing for me about the shape of the Earth is that I know I cannot control it. It does not matter what it is. We do not have the overview whilst we are here. So why should I give my attention to something I cannot control? Why should I care if Trump or Biden is president? I can only control my own personal Universe and any energy I waste on other things only makes me weaker and sustains the Matrix, the control system.
Sorry for the rant. I just wanted to give a little warning for some. Maybe someone will hear and maybe not. My intentions are just to share my insights with my Brother and Sisters.
Love and Gratitude
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Post by Deleted on Feb 3, 2021 21:31:13 GMT
What I have been been leaning toward, through studies is consciousness more than spirit or soul. Immaterial consciousness that sometimes gets called god but any being claiming to be god would be a cheap imitation. Personal consciousness can and does connect with immaterial consciousness in a partnership of experience. I have been working on a few projects that sometimes puzzle me as to how I should execute. Then all of a sudden the idea, the solution comes to me. Understand this is not “my” idea but one that was presented to me. I think some of the amazing minds that are famous for genius just might be better in tune with conscious connection more than the average person. One could call and equate immaterial consciousness with higher self or even guardian angel for some others into such a a thing. Explaining what exactly immaterial consciousness is? Well it is far above my pay grade to offer such an explanation. Be safe in this crazy world all.
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Post by griffo on Feb 23, 2021 14:45:10 GMT
As I have already said (on a former account of mine) I do think quite sure it is round at least in this version of reality ha Somethings are counterintuitive that is why it took a long time to convince people earth is round but the conclusion came from countless observation and testing. But on first glance people only saw flat earth, does it mean earth is flat. But there are many physical observations you can do You do not need to necessarily fly out to space If the earth is flat then why are other planets round? ;P May I add that people used to think the sun went around the earth. The night and day patterns as well as many more phenomena work in the physical reality using such round structure without it these things wouldn't make so much sense. I think looking within is important but physical things like this are best determined by observation. Beyond that there are things that can't be so much and those require different means. There is theory after theory out there but how much water do they really hold, do they really add improvement to things. In one persons theory world could be a theme park for gods, just because we can't 100 per cent disprove it neither makes it true.
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Post by wornout on Jul 2, 2021 3:48:06 GMT
I found this one to be most interesting.
Freemason reveals and explains the shape of the earth
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Post by ConcernedSovereign on Aug 27, 2021 22:49:09 GMT
This is a very well put together series about the subject matter. Well worth the time to watch.
What On Earth Happened? (Ewaranon) 1-13 ~ Another MUST Watch
"This is a compilation of 1-13 of WOEH - however parts 5, 6, 7, and 9, are not in this, I found a channel on GAB that has them all individually, just scroll a bit: "
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Post by ConcernedSovereign on Aug 28, 2021 22:56:27 GMT
Full 6 hours Lost History of Flat Earth documentary
Parts 1-7
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